CAG: One thing I’ve noticed about reading
such writers as Lovecraft, Robert E. Howard, Clark Ashton Smith, Nictzin
Dyalhis, and C. L. Moore is that the emotional power of their prose often comes
from interweaving images of beauty with the grotesque. When the grotesque
images take the form of death and decay, and yet the protagonist of a story is
still attracted to it, I called it EAD (The Erotic Allure of Death). As an
example, I mentioned Smith’s “The Seed from the Sepulcher,” where the main
character is seduced by a beautiful, parasitic monster that he’s just watched
devour his companion. He knows the thing will kill him but cannot fight his
attraction to it.
These same writers also often
introduced what I call EOD (The Erotic Allure of the Other) into their stories.
In Howard’s story, “Worms of the Earth,” Bran Mak Morn must make a bargain with
a half-human witch woman of the moors to achieve his revenge on the Romans. The
woman is described as both lovely and repellent. Bran is simultaneously
disgusted by her and undeniably attracted to her. C. L. Moore did something
similar in her story, “Black God’s Kiss,” where Jirel of Joiry comes upon a
statue of an abhorrent alien god with its lips pursed for a kiss. Jirel
shudders at sight of it, and yet finds herself so drawn to it that she must kiss
the awful lips. Neither Bran nor Jirel are expecting or wanting to die, but
both find themselves simultaneously attracted and repelled by the inhuman
aspects of another being.
(2) SEL; Approach
Avoidance is a psychology term mentioned in your essay. Can you explain that
convey how writers could use such tension for their own character’s dilemmas?
CAG: Typically, tension in a story is
produced by the protagonist wanting something and the antagonist opposing them.
For example, a police officer wants to solve a crime and save a victim from impending
death while the antagonist/criminal fights the officer every step of the way.
The Approach-Avoidance concept adds a deeper layer to this tension. It puts the
protagonist into a position where he, or she, is simultaneously attracted to
and repelled by the same goal. For example, imagine that the police officer
wants to save a kidnap victim, but, at the same time, knows that saving the
victim will destroy the officer’s career because of some secret the victim
knows. Now, the protagonist faces two obstacles, an outer and an inner one.
(3) SEL: On writing poetic
weirdness: You also note that the memorable writers “… expressed it all in
poetic prose without becoming either maudlin or prurient.” Writing accessible,
poetic fiction is what drew me to you in the first place (see review snippets
below). Writing poetically often implies writing abstractly; combined with
weird content, this approach risks alienating the reader. Any tips on how to
balance poeticism with accessibility?
“Across a
snowfield that lies red with dawn, the Orc charge comes. And is met. Axes
shriek on shields. Swords work against armor into flesh. The tips of spears are
wetted. Gore dapples the snow...” - CAG, Harvest of War
“In the bitter twilight of
frost-rimmed peaks, Thal dreamed, the visions crimson with gore. War-horses
frothed at their bits, eyes rolling like bloody pearls. Men in bruised armor
and torn silks of umber and white hacked each other into ragged scarecrows.
Arrows sleeted the sky like sharpened flakes of ice. When it was over the
ravens gathered, scarcely moving as Thal rode among them searching. He found
[spoiler]’s head on a stake.” -CAG, Bitter Steel,Sword and Sorcery
CAG: That question illustrates why this
writing thing is still an art rather than a science. You’re absolutely right.
Poetic writing can distance the reader from the story, and—I think—is
guaranteed to distance some readers
from it. Some folks just don’t like language that is highly metaphorical and
overtly lyrical. For one thing, it requires more effort to read that kind of
writing. And, unless the writer and the reader share certain visual affinities,
the images just won’t translate. For example, I recently used the phrase
“blackshine” in a poem and several members of my writing group said they just couldn’t
picture it. To me, “blackshine” creates a completely concrete visualization.
Imagine the shine of black satin under a silvery light. On the plus side,
though, if poetic writing does connect to a reader, then the communication
between the reader and writer is intensified, and isn’t that what all writers
want—to communicate what’s in our heads to someone else?
I think there are some
strategies that can help poetic writers communicate better with readers. One
thing that you mentioned was “economy.” An economy of words and images is
important. Throwing layer after layer of metaphor at the reader will probably
lose them all. You select one metaphor, one poetic image, and see it through
before adding another. And, whenever possible you temper the metaphorical and
abstract qualities of the writing with simple, concrete language.
I like to think the following
paragraph from my book Cold in the Light
illustrates the process. There’s some metaphorical language (dawn creeping like
a fog), and a hint of the mythical (god or demon), but the core of the piece employs
simple, everyday terms like death, life,
sex, and hunger.
“By the time gray dawn came
creeping like a fog he had mastered himself. He lived in the place that all
warriors sought, where death and life and sex and hunger were one. Where you
created your own reality and no one else's could intrude. Where you became a
god, or a demon. And you didn't care which.”
(4) SEL: Have you ever
employed any EAD or EDO in your own writing?
CAG: Absolutely. As I mentioned in
the article, The Erotic Allure of Death, or EAD, is basic to many horror
stories, and I’ve written a lot of them. My collection, Midnight in Rosary, is mostly about vampires, and vampires are the most
popular manifestation of EAD in our culture. There are very few vampire tales
that don’t combine the monstrous lethality of the creature with the erotic
allure. Certainly Carmilla, by
Sheridan Le Fanu, and Dracula, by
Bram Stoker illustrate this. In Midnight
in Rosary, there is a story called “The Poetry of Blood.” In it, a man
gives himself willing to a vampire because he knows that she will create a work
of erotic art from his death.
To some extent, vampires also
represent Erotic Desire for the Other (EDO). Vampires can be shown as “mostly”
human or as far more grotesque monsters. The more inhuman the vampire, the more
it can represent EDO. An example that particularly stands out for me is the
scene in the movie Bram Stoker’s Dracula
where Lucy is shown having sex with Dracula in his beast form. The scene is set
up to be highly erotic and yet Dracula is clearly not human at that moment. I’m
working on a story now that has elements of this. It’s a Krieg story; you know
that character. In it, Krieg has sex with a sidhe, one of the fairy folk of
Irish and Scottish mythology. At one point, Krieg realizes that he could close his eyes and imagine her as
human. He chooses not to do that. He wants to experience the element of the
other that she represents.
(5) SEL: Is there
something you find repellent and beautiful that others may not appreciate?
CAG: I think it’s probably clear from
much of my horror writing that I find the juxtaposition of gore and beauty to
be interesting. I’m certainly not alone in that. An image that I’ve used in
poems and stories several times is that of the “rotted angel.” An angel is,
arguably, the most beautiful being that humans can imagine. Now imagine that
being with skeletal wings and rotted flesh peeling away from the bone. For me,
adding a layer of gore to the angel’s beauty intensifies the image and evokes
both fascination and disgust.
Another example of this kind of
thing is from a story I wrote called “She Fled, Laughing,” which is a retelling
of a dream I had. In the dream, I was a police officer investigating a murder
scene. I found a young girl who had apparently survived. She wouldn’t let me
get close to her and I finally decided I’d have to run her down to catch her.
When I caught her, and spun her around, her face was just a black hole that
suddenly vomited maggots and roses. So, I literally dream in images that
combine the beautiful and the repellent, and I have since I was a teenager.
(6) SEL: Any tips on how
to create art that is “dark” yet “attractive”?
CAG: Probably the best answer for just
about any writing question is “to read.” For dark fiction, read Poe, read
Stoker, Lovecraft, Bradbury, King, Koontz, read Cormac McCarthy and Clive
Barker, read the classic writers and the new ones. Immerse yourself in the wild
poetry of Dylan Thomas and Bruce Boston. Beyond that, spend some time alone, watch
yourself bleed, sleep in strange beds, take night walks in the woods, visit
ruins and stalk dirt roads on foggy mornings.
(7) SEL: Fine Arts: CAS
was a poet, illustrator, and sculptor; many others interviewed by S.E. have
other artistic talents beyond writing.
Do you practice other arts (Voodoo counts)? If so can we share them
(i.e., images of fine or graphic art) or mp3s (of music). If not, which
artists/pieces inspire you to write?
CAG: Writing is about it for me, but
my writing interests are very broad and include poetry, essays, memoir, and
scientific writing. I don’t really have any drawing or musical skills and am
jealous of those who do. I was in a rock band in high school, but I was the
singer because I wasn’t very good on guitar. I’m most inspired by other writers
and have an “inspiration” shelf of books that I keep handy. When I’m having
trouble with language, I pick up some of those books. The shelf includes the
poetry of Dylan Thomas, Walden by Thoreau,
The Snow Leopard by Peter
Matthiessen, and Blood Meridian by
Cormac McCarthy, as well as The Sowers of
the Thunder by Robert E. Howard.
I am certainly influenced by
music and art. In music, a song that stimulates me lyrically is U2’s “Bullet the Blue Sky.” This is their hardest rock song and the music is great, but I really find the
lyrics to be intensely poetical. Then there’s “Deaf Forever,” by Motorhead, the
best heroic fantasy song ever written. It also has a good bit of poetry in it. I’ve often listened to this while rough
drafting battle scenes. It rather makes you want to go out and kill something!
In art, well, there’s the great
Frank Frazetta, of course. He created such drama in his paintings. My favorites
by him are his Death Dealer and his Kane images. I also really like some older
illustrators such as Roy Krenkel, who illustrated The Sowers of the Thunder, and J. Allen St. John, who illustrated a
lot of Edgar Rice Burroughs stories for the pulps.
(8) SEL: Your wife is a
fine landscape photographer, I wonder if you ever wrote about any of her
photograph’s subjects/locations? Can we share a photo if so?
CAG: Lana’s photography work
certainly inspires me and I’ve used her images on several self-published works,
including “Harmland” and “Adventures of an Arkansawyer.” Her photography has the
same kind of juxtaposition of emotions that we’ve been talking about here. Her
scenes often contain serenity and incredible drama at the same time. I don’t
know how she manages it, but the attached photo perfectly illustrates it.
(9) SEL: You have a
personal goal to publish in a variety of genre markets, and have already
tackled many (westerns like Killing Trail, Sword & Planet with Talera,
Sword & Sorcery and Weird Fiction in Skelos magazine). What is next in
queue? And what motivation drives this?
CAG: I’ve been moving more toward
crime, mystery, and thriller lately and have been reading a lot of that type of
story. “The Scarred One,” my latest book, is a western primarily, but it’s also
a pretty complex mystery as well. I’ve done a couple of short crime stories but
I plan to do more. And I’d kind of like to write a non-supernatural thriller,
something in the vein of Harlan Coben.
I think my motivation for this
goal comes from several sources. One, I enjoy all kinds of writing and when I
read something I like it sets my imagination loose. If I’m enjoying a western,
then the ideas I get tend to be in that genre also. It’s the same for other
genres. Second, it’s a challenge. I like the combination of fear and
exhilaration that comes with trying something new, something I haven’t done
before. Third, I like to think of myself as a writer, not just as a poet, or
essayist, or fantasy author. I’ve chosen writing as a craft and I work hard to
be as good at it as I can, on all levels.
(10) SEL: If you were more juvenile and dressed up on
Halloween, which one of your characters would you be? (Thal Kyrin , Bryle,
Ruenn Maclang, Krieg?)
CAG: If I had my druthers, I’d look
like Krieg. It would be nice to be that bad-ass. But if I had to try to carry
off being one of my characters for Halloween, I’d have to go as an older,
chubbier, and less robust Ruenn Maclang. I’ve got the hair, and a long coat and
sword I could use. I’d just need green contacts.
(11) SEL: Any new works
you can discuss?
CAG: Well, I mentioned my latest, a
western called The Scarred One. It’s under the name Tyler Boone. In keeping
with my rather odd writing goals, I’ve got a children’s book that I’m about to
start submitting to publishers. It’s called Farhaven and is about three
orphaned fox kits trying to make their way to a wildlife sanctuary. I’m also
working on another Krieg short story and something that might possibly turn
into a novel about Krieg. The working title of that is Lords of War. As with
most writers, I’ve always got far more ideas than I can possibly complete in a
lifetime.
Links to SE Reviews/Posts
about Charles A. Gramlich:
